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Session Details
Guest Name Austin Ruse, president of the Catholic Family and Human Rights Institute 
Subject The Establishment of Customary International Law
Date Tuesday,Oct 26 ,2004
Time Makkah
From
... 21:00...To... 22:30
GMT
From
... 18:00...To...19:30
 
Name
Host..    - 
Profession
Answer
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Name
Cathy    - 
Profession
Question Can you explain a bit what this is? I take you mean something other than pre-UN law?
Answer Customary international law refers to law that is established from the practice of nations. It is derived not from treaties or conventions but how things are done by nations over time.

 
Name
Sally    - Egypt
Profession journalist
Question Where do “reservations” made by member countries on signing and ratifying treaties stand in international law? I always believed that such reservations protected culture specific and religion specific areas.
Answer Reservations are vitally important because they allow countries to opt out of specific parts of a document that they find objectionable. They are also vital since they demonstrate that documents are generally far from consensus documents. Cairo proponents say it was a consensus documents but there were a several dozen reservations. Our opponents like to dismiss rerservations for that reason.
 
Name
Ruth    - United Kingdom
Profession nurse
Question As far as I understand—or thought I understood—customary law and conventional law form the basis for international law and, according to the Vienna Convention on the Law of Treaties, norms are only accepted if a “significant” number of states agree and are not rejected by a “significant” number of states. Surely states with Islamic or Islamic based constitutions would form a “significant” number of states disagreeing with specific topics, and so nullify the establishment of, what are to many, unacceptable norms.

Answer Customary law and conventional law are distinct. Conventional law can be established with as many states as the drafters want to establish as the threshold. The ICC came into existence with 60 signatories. I think the Law of the Sea Treaty will come into existence with 20. I am not aware of the need for a "significant" number to establish or reject customary international law.

It is true the Islamic states form an important bloc in the UN and elsewhere. It is with these states that much mischief has been stopped at the UN. This has been done through the use of "consensus." So, the Islamic bloc has been able to gather enough states to block consensus on a whole host of issues.

 
Name
Khadijah    - Japan
Profession
Question Many Muslim NGOs object to the UN’s insistence on using the word “gender” in its documents, believing that this is opening the door to accepting and legalizing homosexuality. Do you or your organization have a similar perspective on the use of this word?

Answer Of course! Gender was created precisely to sidestep nature. Some at Beijing were promoting the idea of 5 genders. Others say there are 7. The primary issue on gender these days is the proposition that it is a social construct, that little boys only want to play with trucks because we force them culturally. They believe that everything is elastic, that everything can be changed.

Yes, we agree on gender...
 
Name
Hussein    - 
Profession
Question Whoa! FIVE genders!? Isn't gender just male and female? What is this?
Answer The differnet definitions are based on actions. Do a google on "five genders" and see all the good stuff that comes up. They are heterosexual men, heterosexual woman, homosexual men, homosexual women, transgender....or something like that. You see, it is based on behavior. But do that google. It is vitally important that you show your supporters how crazy things can get, especially in the west.
 
Name
Mohamed    - United States
Profession accountant
Question When did this UN conference cycle begin? And more importantly, WHY? Who or what started it? Can it be stopped? Should it be stopped?
Answer The UN began with a conference and all its key documents were negotiated that way. This current round began well before the end of the Cold War, but it really picked up speed in the 1990s. It was as if all this pent up social enegy burst forth. It happened to a large extent because they knew that UN documents could be used to force governments to change their laws. These documents change their laws.

These documents, which are mostly non-binding, are used as a hammer against small states and as a rapier against powerful states. Small states are threatened with losing aid. Large states are undermined with these documents through their own courts systems.

Even the big powerful US has been undermined with these documents. A year ago our Supreme Court made homosexual sodomy a Constitutional right. In that decision the majority ruling referenced documents from foreign countries, mostly the EU, that say that homosexuality cannot be discriminated against. This has never happened before, that foreign decisions were used to interpret our consitution.

The courts say we must pay attention to world opinion. We point out they did not rely on Shari`ah.

Should they be stopped? That would be the best of all possible worlds. In the meantime, the other side has slowed them down becuase of the heavy pro-life influence of the US. Did you hear about Cairo +10 that was supposed to happen this year? How about Beijing +10 that should be happening next year? No, you have heard of neither because they were stopped by UN radicals who were afraid of losing.

 
Name
Mustafa    - 
Profession
Question In the UN Web site, the Introduction to the International Law Commission, says:
"The Governments participating in the drafting of the Charter of the United Nations were overwhelmingly opposed to conferring on the United Nations legislative power to enact binding rules of international law. As a corollary, they also rejected proposals to confer in the General Assembly the power to impose certain general conventions on States by some form of majority vote. There was, however, strong support for conferring on the General Assembly the more limited powers of study and recommendation ..."

Doesn’t this whole idea of customary law conflict with this?
Answer The UN speaks to the world through non-binding resolutions, even when they do big conferences, like Beijing and Cairo. Those documents are only non-binding UN resolutions that have no force in law. They are not in any sense legislating. Where customary international law comes in is how those documents are then used. For instance, our opponents say that the repeated use of the phrase "reproductive heath" in non-binding UN documents has established a new customary international law. What they mean is that 1) if all the nations have repeatedly agreed to the phrase and its meaning, then 2) cusomary international law has been established such that 3) abortion is the law of the world and 4) all countries must acceed to it.
 
Name
Sherif    - Egypt
Profession pilot
Question We want to protect our traditional family and religious values. The idea that Western norms can be enforced on our constitution is scary. But is it really likely to happen? Has such a thing actually happened? Can you give me an example?

Answer Well, here is the dirty little secret that the UN does not want you to know ... they have no enforcement power. They are toothless. They cannot force you to do anything. A few years ago Austrailia told the UN human rights "special rappateurs" that they were no longer welcome in their country. These special reporters were saying the Australians were beastly to the aborigines. The Australians disagreed and disagreed so strongly, they told the UN human rights treaty bodies that they were no longer welcome in their country and that Australia would no longer participate in the UN treaty monitoriing system. When they did this the world did not end and neither did Australia.

Here is the thing, though. Strong countries can do that. Weak countries cannot. Little Nicaragua faced a similar situatiuon a few years ago. They were told by the EU counties that they had to change their definition of gender. Nicaragua resisted and they were threatened with losing millions in aid. So, they were forced to relent. The lesson is 1) the UN is inherently weak, 2) states are strong and 3) weak states are still coerced by strong states.
 
Name
Beth    - Canada
Profession
Question Women are oppressed all over the world and all you people want to do is continue to dominate and subjugate them with your patriarchal religions. You’ve had a few thousand years to straighten things out, but you haven’t succeeded. It’s high time you admit your failure and let another worldview take over. Make women equal to men and let them control their own finances and their own bodies. Let women decide whether and when they have children. Give women control over their bodies and their lives!
Answer It is a silly question that Christianity is patriarchal. I will answer about abortion. There is a growing movement in this country and around the world of women who have had abortions and found out the experience both short- and long- term was deeply harmful, both physically and psychologically. There is a growing body of evidence that abortion is linked to cancer, for instance.

The abortion debate is winding down in this country since all of the arguments for it are ending. The humanity of the unborn child is now widely agreed to. This has happened because of science (sonograms, fetal surgery, etc). The final argument is that abortion is somehow good or necessary for women. The fact is that most women choose abortion because they had no choice (interesting word that).

The Alan Guttmacher Institute (part of Planned Parenthood) does research on why women choose abortion and it found the two main reasons are (1) lack of financial support and (2) lack of emotional support. The pro-life movement is waking up to this and you will begin to see massive changes to address these issues. The pro-abortion arguments are now losing in this country.
 
Name
Jack    - 
Profession
Question I think about the only thing these UN conferences do is boost the airline, hotel, and restaurant industries. Save the Children Sweden showed that after all the fuss made about the Convention on the Rights of the Child, the world’s children are no better off. So why is so much money being spent by governments and the private sector on these conferences?

Answer Most countries take these conferences very very seriously and they try to enact the documents. Certainly it is true that these documents are worthless unless governments take them seriously. Most really don't. Some do. If they are good documents that is good. If they are bad, watch out ...
 
Name
Pedro    - 
Profession
Question Who makes international law? Is it only the United Nations? And on the international basis, who decides that something is customary?

Answer International law is made by treaty or convention. This is between and among states. The UN does not make international law. It can initiate conferences that lead to treaties and conventions, but still the law itself is only made when governments agree among themselves.

How does one decide customary? That is very tricky. It is hard to say when it has been arrived at. It is generally derived over decades of common usage. Slavery, for instance, is outlawed in some states but not all. Still, it is widely understood to be against customary international law.

For an interesting look at this, go to my Web site Catholic Family and Human Rights Institute
http://c-fam.org
and download the "secret documents." These are the internal memos from a strategy meeting of the Center for Reproductive Rights and shows how they plan to establish a customary international law on abortion. They threatened to sue me for having and printing these. I laughed. Read them. They are an eye-opener.
 
Name
Selma    - 
Profession
Question I’ve heard that there is concern that the term “reproductive health services” will by custom come to include abortion. Are there any other specific terms in these conference cycles that you are concerned about?
Answer Actually, we have won on reproducitve health services. A Canadian delegate blurted out during the Child Summit +10, "I shouldn't say this but reproductive health services means abortion." There was a riot. So, that has been permanently poisoned (good). The main problematic term is "reproducitve health" or "reproductive rights." Also, "sexual rights." These phrases come up a great deal.
 
Name
Vladimir    - 
Profession
Question In its Web site, the International Committee of the Red Cross says, "Customary international law takes into account the practices and beliefs of all states around the world. It is culturally neutral so to speak.”

Is customary law really culturally neutral? Your NGO and others have expressed concern over how the various agencies of the UN interpret terms, afraid that they may become customary. If the UN is doing the interpreting, and if it really is overrun by radical feminists as you say, that can hardly be seen as culturally neutral, can it?

Answer Yes, the UN and its interpretation of documents is far, far from culturally neutral. The Committee that enforces the CEDAW convention has directed China to legalize prostitution, has directed Belarus not to establish Mother's Day, has directed Libya to reinterpret the Qur'an to fit within committee guidelines. Sound neutral to anyone?
 

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